Question:
fined for speeding but no speed limit signs?
2013-08-08 07:25:57 UTC
I'm in the UK, been fined for doing 38mph in a 30mph zone (my bad, I know), but there are no markings anywhere along that road to indicate it is a 30mph zone at all. Can I appeal against this decision based on this fact? Thanks
Eight answers:
carswoody
2013-08-09 07:02:52 UTC
Any road with regular street lighting has a default speed limit of 30 mph unless signs indicate otherwise. The entry to a 30 mph zone must be marked by a "30" sign on both sides of the road, but no repeater signs are permitted within the zone (on the grounds that they might be confusing if some roads had them and others didn't). "30" roundels on the road surface are however permitted, with a special dispensation.



In some circumstances, where a side road has a lower limit than the main road, only one speed limit sign for the lower limit is needed, on the left-hand side of the road, and no signs at all are needed for the higher limit if there are repeater signs on the main road indicating the limit within 100 yards of the junction.



Where there is no street lighting, the default limit is 60 mph for single-carriageway and 70 mph for dual carriageway roads. This is referred to as the "National Speed Limit" (NSL), and entry to these zones is marked by the familiar "derestriction" sign with a diagonal black stripe on a white background. Repeater signs are not normally used but are not specifically prohibited.



Any other limit requires roadside repeater signs at regular intervals prescribed by law. The mere fact that a road runs through an urban or rural area makes no difference to the speed limit - it is the presence or absence of street lighting. Thus a lit dual carriageway in a rural environment would have a 30 limit unless signs indicate otherwise, and the speed limit through the snooty Cheshire village of Prestbury, which still refuses to have street lighting, would be 60 in the absence of 30 signs and repeaters.



An increasing number of lit NSL roads (for example the A556 between the M6 Junction 19 and Lostock near Northwich), are now being given "60" or "70" repeaters rather than NSL ones. Presumably the thinking is that this makes the speed limit clearer, as there is evidence that the NSL is not properly understood by drivers, but it must add another layer of confusion as they will wonder what is the difference between a single-carriageway 60 road and an NSL one.



20 mph repeaters are not required within a signed 20 mph zone if the limit is in effect self-enforcing through the use of traffic calming measures. However, if there is little or no traffic calming, 20 mph repeaters are required for the limit to be enforceable.



All roads with a motorway designation, e.g. M6 or A627(M), have a default speed limit of 70 mph unless signs indicate otherwise - for example, the A57(M) Mancunian Way in Manchester has a 50 mph limit as it has some very tight junctions. This 70 limit includes the handful of single-carriageway roads with motorway status such as the A6144(M) off the M60 near Sale.



Speed limit roundels painted on the road surface may be used to supplement a system of speed limit repeaters, but on their own do not constitute a legal system of speed limit marking. For a limit to be enforceable, the proper number of repeaters must also be present.



An exception to this is that the 40 mph limits covering large areas of Dartmoor and the New Forest have a specific derogation from the need to have repeaters because of environmental considerations, and are therefore marked solely by carriageway roundels.



All UK speed limits must be in multiples of 10 mph, as there is no requirement for vehicle speedometers to show increments of less than 10 mph (although in practice most have 5 mph increments). Thus the option does not exist to have 35 mph or 45 mph limits as are commonly found in the USA. It is an irritating feature of many speedometers that the numbers shown are 20, 40, 60, 80 etc. when the two most important speed limits to most drivers are 30 mph and 70 mph
2013-08-08 15:37:16 UTC
You have no grounds for appeal.



All speed limits apply from the signs at the start of the "zone" until the signs at the end, which indicate the next speed limit "zone". You must have passed 30 signs at some point and if you had not passed any signs showing the limit had ended then it still applied.



There is no obligation to place repeaters at all, although these are often provided for 40 and 50 mph limits.



It is illegal to post standard repeaters for 30 mph limits, which is why you never see the small round white with red circle signs in a 30 zone. They are always a different shape and colour.



A 30 mph limit will also have lamp posts placed at 150-200 metre intervals.



If you tell the magistrate that you missed the signs then you'll also get "done" for driving without due care and attention.



It's all in the Highway Code.
Clive
2013-08-09 00:58:32 UTC
No. The general limit in built-up areas with street lighting is 30 mph and you're expected to know that from having studied the Highway Code to get through your driving test. Therefore speed limit signs are not posted. On any other road subject to a 30 mph limit there will have been a speed limit sign to signal the start of the zone and you're expected to have seen it. You have no grounds for appeal.



My guess is you haven't been fined, you have been given a fixed penalty. If you haven't been summoned to court, it is most certainly a fixed penalty. I know it feels just the same as being fined but there is a HUGE technical difference. Pay it before the date stated and you don't get a criminal record. The idea of a fixed penalty is to deal with minor offences without taking up court time, but if you don't pay it by the due date you will be summoned to the magistrates' court (justice of the peace court in Scotland), be formally convicted of speeding (which will give you a criminal record) and receive a much larger fine.
?
2013-08-08 14:34:49 UTC
We are all supposed to know that the speed limit in built up areas is 30 MPH unless there are signs setting a different limit. You often see a 30 MPH sign at the beginning of the speed restricted area but not after that. Sorry, that's the way it is.
?
2013-08-08 14:28:13 UTC
if you read your highway code, a road with no markers IS a 30mph zone!!!

all other zones are denoted with signs!

they do this cos 30mph zones are th most common zones and it would cost a small fortune to place enough signs everywhere.



so, no is the answer to your question!

sorry!
?
2013-08-08 15:22:18 UTC
How did you pass your test when you are so obviously unaware of how speed restrictions work in the UK.



Read your highway code for more info.
Tedward
2013-08-08 15:59:47 UTC
Re visit the area and make sure there are no signs at the start of the 30 mph. If there are, then repeater signs not required under certain conditions. If there are are they obscured in any etc, Other than that, no help.
motorists_advocate
2014-03-07 15:33:29 UTC
GB needs to stop using the speed derestriction sign.


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